Re: Pil 1

On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 7:58 PM, <lua-l-request@lists.lua.org> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

� 1. Re: PiL 1 (Ezequiel Garc?a)
� 2. Re: atpanic chaining? (AllanPfalzgraf@eaton.com)
� 3. Re: PiL 1 (Tim Caswell)
� 4. Re: LuaSocket: No way to protect against fuzzing attacks?
� � �(Matthew Wild)
� 5. Re: LuaSocket: No way to protect against fuzzing attacks?
� � �(Petite Abeille)
� 6. Re: PiL 1 (Roberto Ierusalimschy)
� 7. Re: PiL 1 (Stuart P. Bentley)
� 8. Re: PiL 1 (Alexander Gladysh)
� 9. Re: PiL 1 (Alexander Gladysh)
�10. Re: PiL 1 (Alexander Gladysh)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 10:18:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ezequiel Garc?a <elezegarcia@yahoo.com.ar>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID:
� � � �<1318439916.24013.YahooMailClassic@web39324.mail.mud.yahoo.com">1318439916.24013.YahooMailClassic@web39324.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
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--- El mi�2-oct-11, Javier Guerra Giraldez <javier@guerrag.com> escribi�r>
> De: Javier Guerra Giraldez <javier@guerrag.com>
> Asunto: Re: PiL 1
> Para: "Lua mailing list" <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
> Fecha: mi�oles, 12 de octubre de 2011, 15:09
> 2011/10/12 Ezequiel Garc�<elezegarcia@yahoo.com.ar>:
> > Mmm... didn't try that actually. I expected to walk
> into a bookshop
> > and just buy a book. Maybe I am just too lazy ?
>
> i'm too lazy for bookshops :-)� that's why i'd love to
> buy on amazon,
> but shipping to Per�often more expensive than the
> book.

Pil 2 book is 24 USD in Amazon. That's like 100 of my money, the cost
of any decent book. So it is very affordable.

But as Javier says, shipment is expensive. And then comes taxes.
I don't know what the total cost of the book would be.
I believe buying a book should be a little easier.
Not to mention not everyone owns a credit card.

And beside, why do I have to buy a book written by a Brazilian
guy from Amazon, shipped from USA !?!? It is a bit crazy... :(

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 13:20:27 -0400
From: <AllanPfalzgraf@eaton.com>
Subject: Re: atpanic chaining?
To: <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
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� � � �<4FC6198A618792428E917F64FC7E591504A42FA0@CLEOHSMB03.napa.ad.etn.com">4FC6198A618792428E917F64FC7E591504A42FA0@CLEOHSMB03.napa.ad.etn.com>
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�Thanks for the clarification. �I'll get to work.

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Subject: lua-l Digest, Vol 15, Issue 47

Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 09:22:34 -0500
From: Rob Hoelz <rob@hoelz.ro>
Subject: Re: atpanic chaining?
To: lua-l@lists.lua.org
Message-ID: <20111012092234.2737811b@hoelz.ro">20111012092234.2737811b@hoelz.ro>
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On Wed, 12 Oct 2011 10:07:18 -0400
<AllanPfalzgraf@eaton.com> wrote:

> Does lua_atpanic() add to the process for a panic condition or just
> replace the process?
> I am writing a set of libraries for communication using several
> protocols. �In many situations more than one protocol is in use in a
> single application. �Each protocol has its own shutdown procedure that

> should be called for a clean exit in a panic. �If each protocol makes
> its own call to lua_atpanic() will all the panic functions be called
> or only the last one to be registered?
>
>
> � � � Allan Pfalzgraf
> � � � EATON
>
> � � � 4201 North 27 Street
> � � � Milwaukee, WI 53216
> � � � tel: 414 449-6872
> � � � fax: 414 449-6616
> � � � AllanPfalzgraf@eaton.com
> � � � www.Eaton.com <http://www.eaton.com/> <http://www.eaton.com/>
>
>

Replaces. �You could write a panic function that calls each member of a
list of panic functions, though.

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 10:26:45 -0700
From: Tim Caswell <tim@creationix.com>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID:
� � � �<CAGkHjAXO0EO=3NXR8LayXSvai1JhKSJbTuq6JEtc6W8=AdwwAw@mail.gmail.com>
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There is always the pdf version. �If you have an email and a paypal
account or something, that should be all you need. �I find the pdf
version super useful since the table of contents can be in the left
pane and allow hyperlinknig.

2011/10/12 Ezequiel García <elezegarcia@yahoo.com.ar>:
>
> --- El mié 12-oct-11, Javier Guerra Giraldez <javier@guerrag.com> escribió:
>
>> De: Javier Guerra Giraldez <javier@guerrag.com>
>> Asunto: Re: PiL 1
>> Para: "Lua mailing list" <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
>> Fecha: miércoles, 12 de octubre de 2011, 15:09
>> 2011/10/12 Ezequiel García <elezegarcia@yahoo.com.ar>:
>> > Mmm... didn't try that actually. I expected to walk
>> into a bookshop
>> > and just buy a book. Maybe I am just too lazy ?
>>
>> i'm too lazy for bookshops :-) that's why i'd love to
>> buy on amazon,
>> but shipping to Perú is often more expensive than the
>> book.
>
> Pil 2 book is 24 USD in Amazon. That's like 100 of my money, the cost
> of any decent book. So it is very affordable.
>
> But as Javier says, shipment is expensive. And then comes taxes.
> I don't know what the total cost of the book would be.
> I believe buying a book should be a little easier.
> Not to mention not everyone owns a credit card.
>
> And beside, why do I have to buy a book written by a Brazilian
> guy from Amazon, shipped from USA !?!? It is a bit crazy... :(
>
>

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 18:42:41 +0100
From: Matthew Wild <mwild1@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: LuaSocket: No way to protect against fuzzing attacks?
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
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On 12 October 2011 17:16, Sam Roberts <vieuxtech@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 10:36 PM, HyperHacker <hyperhacker@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I can't seem to reproduce the missing-last-bytes issue except in my
>> server, which is rather large and complex for a testcase and is using
>> threading and the acceptfd patch. (I did test acceptfd in a smaller
>> script as well.) Who knows why that's happening.
>
> What's the acceptfd patch?

It allows creating a LuaSocket object from an fd. Would be very
useful, but not provided in standard LuaSocket because of portability
concerns (ie. Windows).

Regards,
Matthew

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 19:51:12 +0200
From: Petite Abeille <petite.abeille@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: LuaSocket: No way to protect against fuzzing attacks?
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID: <EFD984F8-5A3A-4B3F-9644-75C352CEA421@gmail.com">EFD984F8-5A3A-4B3F-9644-75C352CEA421@gmail.com>
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On Oct 12, 2011, at 7:42 PM, Matthew Wild wrote:

>> What's the acceptfd patch?
>
> It allows creating a LuaSocket object from an fd. Would be very
> useful, but not provided in standard LuaSocket because of portability
> concerns (ie. Windows).

http://www.net-core.org/39/lua/patching-luasocket-to-make-it-compatible
http://www.net-core.org/dl/luasocket-2.0.2-acceptfd.patch

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 16:04:36 -0300
From: Roberto Ierusalimschy <roberto@inf.puc-rio.br>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID: <20111012190436.GB25905@inf.puc-rio.br">20111012190436.GB25905@inf.puc-rio.br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

> And beside, why do I have to buy a book written by a Brazilian
> guy from Amazon, shipped from USA !?!? It is a bit crazy... :(

Because Ligthning Source is in the USA. There is no similar service here
in Brazil. (There are print-on-demand companies in Brazil, but they only
sell the book through their own sites. Moreover, big bookstores here in
Brazil do not sell self-published books.)

-- Roberto

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2011 15:46:44 -0700
From: "Stuart P. Bentley" <stuart@testtrack4.com>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: lua-l@lists.lua.org
Message-ID: <op.v29f76h880arbn@stuzee>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15; format=flowed;
� � � �delsp=yes

Maybe mention that you prefer prospective employees to have posted
questions on Stack Overflow?

On Wed, 12 Oct 2011 04:25:40 -0700, Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 15:17, Matthew Wild <mwild1@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 12 October 2011 12:05, Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 15:00, Petite Abeille
>>> <petite.abeille@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 12, 2011, at 12:47 PM, Alexander Gladysh wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I humbly ask Lua team to stop confusing people and remove PiL 1 from
>>>>> free access.
>>>>
>>>> Nonsense. Get a grip :)
>>>
>>> For me this not a nonsense, but a real problem that eats time.
>>>
>>> We continuously hire programmers to code in Lua. Almost everyone does
>>> not have prior experience with the language. Almost everyone stumbles
>>> upon this problem.
>>
>> And you can't afford a non-free copy of the book for these people?
>
> We can and we do sponsor the purchases.
>
> The problem is that people start reading PiL when they get invited to
> the interview or even earlier. I guess that we have to put "do not
> read PiL 1" in the vacancy text, but that's a little ridiculous.
>
> Alexander.
>

------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 03:49:53 +0400
From: Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID:
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On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 17:15, Dirk Laurie <dirk.laurie@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/10/12 Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com>:
>
>> But I have to repeat the same things over and over again for the newbies.
>
> This is not a PiL1 problem. It is not even a Lua problem. Have you ever:
>
> 1. Minded small children for a whole day?
> 2. Taught a freshman calculus course?
> 3. Explained to your wife how to squeeze toothpaste?

Not to the same poor newbie, mind you.

Alexander.

------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 03:50:46 +0400
From: Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID:
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On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 02:46, Stuart P. Bentley <stuart@testtrack4.com> wrote:
> Maybe mention that you prefer prospective employees to have posted questions
> on Stack Overflow?

Employees are too scarse nowadays for that.

Alexander.

------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2011 03:56:38 +0400
From: Alexander Gladysh <agladysh@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: PiL 1
To: Lua mailing list <lua-l@lists.lua.org>
Message-ID:
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On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 17:48, Roberto Ierusalimschy
<roberto@inf.puc-rio.br> wrote:
>> Furthermore, please do not open access to PiL 2 when PiL 3 would be published.
>
> Just for correction: we did not open the access to PiL 1 when we
> published PiL 2. It went free online a few months after we published it
> (see http://www.lua.org/news.html), years before PiL 2. It did hurt the
> sales of the printed version, so we decided not to open the access to
> the second edition.

OK, thank you for the information.

It is a bit offtopic, but maybe you care to share a relative ballpark
of damage it did (like in "20% drop")? (Sorry, that's a very rude
question, not intended in preparation for the counter-attack on the
free PiL 2 topic. I'm really curious. Feel free to ignore.)

> The book gives us more than pocket money (although not enough for a 50
> foot yacht yet). In fact, buying books is a very good way to contribute
> to the project. So, currently we have no plans to put newer editions
> free online.

> Alexander has reasons for his complain. Many people arrive at the book
> through Google, frequently landing right on a particular page. No amount
> of warning in the main page will help. And the outdated information may
> be a real source of noise. For instance, some time ago we had to add a
> warning on a page (http://www.lua.org/pil/24.1.html), after too many
> complains that "a first example" did not work.

Thank you for the support.

> To remove PiL 1 from the site seems a too radical "solution",

Which I withdrawn. Sorry for the outburst :)

> but I think we could do something about this problem.
> One solution would be to add warnings about deprecated features (like the one about
> luaL_openlibs). That seems a lot of work. Another would be to add a
> generic warning (maybe with a link to the "Incompatibilities" section of
> the manual and adds for the second edition ;) at the top of every page.

If you could do that, would be great.

Thanks,
Alexander.

------------------------------

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